Interview episode of "Off The Record With Paul Giannamore" featuring Ken Fox, former owner of Presto Pest Control, described as the entry platform acquisition of Thompson Street Capital's PestCo Holdings. Part of a series hosted by Paul Giannamore covering business owners in the pest control and residential services space, with an M&A focus. # Observable Channel Presentation Evidence ## Video Format & Presentation - **Interview-style podcast recorded on video**: The host, Paul Giannamore, conducts a long-form conversational interview with a guest, Ken Fox, founder of Presto Pest Control, recorded on location in San Juan, Puerto Rico. > "Ken Fox welcome to San Juan Puerto Rico... we can do this live in San Juan and you said the people demand this space so here we are" - The host frames the episode as highly anticipated and audience-driven: > "this is an episode that I've literally been waiting for a year to do" > "the public clamored for it" - The tone is informal and humorous, with the host joking with the guest (e.g., the "Ken and Barbie" exchange, a joke about his parents' marriage), indicating a casual, personality-driven presentation style. ## Demonstrated Scope / Subject Matter - The channel demonstrates coverage of the **pest control industry**, specifically: - Founder origin stories ("your story is actually just the most entertaining story in Pest Control going") - **Mergers and acquisitions in pest control**: The guest sold his company to a private equity firm. > "Ken you sold presto to Thompson Street Capital Partners Pesco portfolio... it's just a little over a year ago" - Operational business topics: compensation models, route building, hiring, sales strategy, commercial vs. residential focus. - Personal/founder life topics: family, retirement, career trade-offs. - The host references his own advisory role with pest control owners: > "even though you deal with Pest Control owners all day" > "you're flying around you're working so many hours why do you do what you do" This suggests, though does not explicitly state, that the host works with pest control business owners in a professional capacity. ## Intended Audience (Observable Evidence) - The content is aimed at **pest control business owners and industry professionals**, evidenced by: - Industry-specific terminology used without explanation (recurring revenue, gross margins, revenue multiples, off-label pesticide application, route-based service, registered vs. certified technicians). - The host's summary: "you grew one of the largest Pure Play commercial pest control companies in the United States" - Guest advice addressed to someone "starting a commercial Pest Control business." - The audience is also implicitly familiar with the host's work, as the host refers to past meetings with the guest ("I remember sitting in Philly... you were showing me live how this all works"). ## Explicit Self-Description - No direct channel mission statement or self-description (e.g., "this channel is about X") appears in the transcript. - The closest self-referential statement from the host about his motivation: > "this is why I do what I do... to see how happy guys like you are when we finally cross that Finish Line" This is a personal statement within the conversation, not a channel-level description. ## Creator Claims vs. Demonstrated Patterns - **Creator claims**: The host claims long-standing relationships with industry figures and deep involvement in pest control M&A ("I do what I do to have conversations with guys like you... to see how these stories play out"). - **Demonstrated patterns**: The video itself demonstrates long-form, on-location video interviews with pest control founders, blending business operational detail with personal biography, delivered with humor and informal rapport. ## Metadata Note - No curated metadata was supplied beyond the title. The title, *"Ken Fox of Presto Pest Control | Off The Record With Paul Giannamore,"* itself presents the channel's format: a series ("Off The Record") of named-guest interviews hosted by Paul Giannamore, focused on identifiable pest control industry figures. # Delivery Observation: Ken Fox Interview — *Off The Record With Paul Giannamore* ## Conversational Format - **Interview/podcast style**: host Paul Giannamore drives with questions; guest Ken Fox delivers long narrative answers. Confirmed in title and throughout, e.g., "Ken Fox welcome to San Juan Puerto Rico." - **Friendly, informal register**: frequent banter and interruption — "we have Ken and Barbie can you believe that." - **Live interruptions from off-camera**: mid-episode others join — "Franco look at this, this is you in 30 years dude" — with a toast: "cheers by the way." ## Ken Fox's Delivery Patterns ### Storytelling-First Answers - Nearly every question is answered with an **anecdote rather than a summary**: the TV-host discovery story ("aren't you Ken Fox… he said no really what are you doing now"), the customer who didn't recognize him on TV ("he looks exactly like you and he sounds like you"), and the off-label pesticide indictment told as a sequence. - He uses **self-deprecating humor** repeatedly: "I think I was 42" (re: puberty), "put on my best Miami Vice clothes," "I won a lot of fights that I really lost." ### Maxims and Aphorisms - A highly stable habit: he tags lessons with **memorable one-liners**: - > "the only thing that come to those who wait is stuff that nobody else wanted" - > "love one… trust few" - > "it's not personal, it's business — I hate that line" - > "a callback… that's called a second chance" - > "suck life for all it's got man… you don't know when your ticket's gonna be checked" - He flags the habit himself: "you know another line… I have all these lines I know." ### Numeric Specificity - Frequent **concrete figures** when describing operations: "25 percent… certified tech 30 percent," "eight thousand dollars a week… 2400 a week… about 130 000 a year," "11 service operation areas," growth of "30 or more 40 in some years." This precision appears only in the business-mechanics passages, not in the personal anecdotes. ### Hesitation and Filler - Noticeable **filler clusters** in interview settings, especially early: "you know as a as a Founder person that… um there's um there's an emotional attachment." The fillers thin out when he shifts into a rehearsed-sounding story or maxim — delivery becomes fluid mid-anecdote. ### Deferred/Redirected Answers - Twice he **soft-pedals direct emotional questions**: on divorce ("it is what it is"), on regret ("did the means justify the end? I don't know but right now where I'm sitting life is good"). These are the shortest answers he gives. ## Paul Giannamore's Host Patterns - **Playful provocations**: "is that when you really ramped up the drug usage or what," "how do you think their sex life is" (followed by "we'll be right back"). - **Recap-and-confirm habit**: he summarizes the guest's long answers back: "so I'm your technician… you effectively grew one of the largest Pure Play commercial pest control companies… and you had no sales people not one." - **References shared history**: "I remember sitting in Philly… we were right at where were we." ## Uncertainty Notes - Transcript is **auto-generated** ("Pesco portfolio," "the Mexican" possibly a mis-transcription of a name); exact wording of some quotes is uncertain. - Intonation, pacing, and visual delivery cues are **not observable** from transcript alone; claims about emotional delivery (e.g., soft-pedaling) rest on brevity and word choice, not vocal evidence. # Observation Record: Ken Fox of Presto Pest Control | Off The Record With Paul Giannamore ## Overview - **Format:** In-person interview in San Juan, Puerto Rico, with host Paul Giannamore interviewing Ken Fox, founder of Presto Pest Control, roughly one year after Fox sold Presto to Thompson Street Capital Partners (Pesco portfolio), around September 21st per Fox. - **Speakers:** Paul Giannamore (host, M&A advisor) and Ken Fox (founder, Presto Pest Control). ## Background & Origin Story (Ken Fox) - Paid his way through Temple University as a **broadcast major (radio, TV, film)**, working part-time in radio in Philadelphia and in pest control during summers. - Worked in advertising sales and broadcasting in New York and Philadelphia post-college, but wanted his own business ("always had that love of the Horatio Alger story... didn't have a rich uncle"). - Started his pest control company in his 20s, **naively and without a real business plan**; his bosses thought he was "clinically nuts" to leave for exterminating. - Initially residential; grew by **literally knocking on doors**. ## The TV Hosting Episode (Fox) - While servicing a Philadelphia TV station (one with an American Bandstand-style dance show), a producer who remembered him from radio invited him to substitute-host live shows, starting in **1985** ("put on my best Miami Vice clothes"). - Ran the pest control business during the day while hosting. - Told an anecdote of a customer watching him on TV while he serviced her home upstairs who never recognized him — "not only does he have the same name as you, he looks exactly like you." - Realized he was again working for someone else and shifted emphasis from residential toward **commercial accounts**. ## The Presto Philosophy (Fox) - Renamed the company **Presto** to signify speed: every call, email, or message returned **in under an hour**. - Slogan: "The only thing that comes to those who wait is stuff that nobody else wanted." - Believed in authenticity and humor with customers, and that your occupation defines a third of your life. ## Hiring & Sales Model (Fox) - Hired non-traditional candidates: **assistant school principals, restaurant district managers, retired health inspectors**. - **Never had a single salesperson**; grew 30–40%+ in some years. - Fox built routes himself door-to-door, then hired "Prince Charming" — the right person — to take over each route, paying them more than the route initially earned. - **"You can train anybody to become a good pest control person, but you can't train a person what kind of a person to be."** - Technicians serviced a maximum of ~6 hours/day; the remaining ~2 hours ("**Tech Ops**") were spent visiting existing accounts to build relationships (e.g., meeting the diner owner at 2 PM, thanking them personally). - Door-knocking pitch: technicians looked like working men, not slick salesmen — "this will work in any service business." Same tech who sells the account services it, unlike a salesman who "sells it and disappears." - Never leave a business card; leave a marketing piece with name and cell number written in **red marker**. - Giannamore confirmed he witnessed the technician-relationship model live at a Stephen Starr restaurant in Center City Philadelphia. ## Equipment & Presentation Rules (Fox) - **No technician could ever carry a spray tank in public view** — the silver tank is "a warning sign" that could drive customers away from a restaurant; most restaurants are required by ordinance to have pest control anyway. - **Impeccable dress**: company purchased everything "except your socks, your underwear and your belt" — laundered pants, weather-appropriate shirts, slip-proof shoes, company hats; no sports team apparel. ## Compensation (Fox) - Registered technicians: **25% of gross receipts** of their route; certified technicians: **30%**. - Example: an $8,000/week urban route → ~$2,400/week → roughly **$130,000/year**, no nights or weekends; "virtually no turnover." - Claimed six-figure salaries were "not uncommon" at Presto. ## Personal Cost & Family (Fox) - Expanded from Philadelphia to Baltimore, Washington, Richmond; lived in hotels during the week, home on weekends; restarted door-knocking in each new market. - Called himself "**Kenny overdo it**" (childhood nickname from his uncle). - **Called his two divorces his "biggest failure in life"** and "collateral damage" of being all-in on the business; came from a family with no prior divorces. The business "became a diversion" for his first marriage. - Now 66; two young children from a later relationship — Natalie (22) and Eric (18, a student pilot). Speaks with them daily; visits his daughter at Temple. - Parents (father ~91, mother 89) are "my heroes," still married and active; his father was the **first person he called after the sale closed**. - First grandchild via Natalie's daughter is due in January; Giannamore offered congratulations. ## COVID Response (Fox) - Shut down for only one or two days in March 2020, then resumed large commercial accounts immediately. - Used hockey's **plus/minus** metaphor for evaluating employees; as managers recalled laid-off staff, roughly **one-third of the workforce was not brought back**. - Result: operated "much more efficiently," incomes of remaining field staff "zoomed" under production-based pay, and the company became "extremely profitable" by summer 2020. - **"COVID... was the best thing that ever happened to this company."** That September he contacted Giannamore about a sale. - Fox reflected: "why didn't I do this when I was 40 years old?" — growth had been his sole focus, with profits reinvested (van purchases, hiring sprees); the company never used its lines of credit despite growth. ## The 2008 Indictment (Fox) - In ~2008, five technicians in one state misapplied pesticides **off-label**; a disgruntled employee reported it to state regulators. - The law held those in charge responsible, "right up to me" — Fox was **indicted on five counts**. - He **pled guilty to one charge**, paid a fine, got a mugshot, and agreed to leave the state (unnamed; joked his flag "only has 49 stars"); charges were **expunged** after a year of good behavior. - Fox stated he never knew about the misapplication and was only reviewing chemical purchase numbers — this he now frames as **delegating without delegating effectively**; he became more involved in hiring afterward. - Giannamore noted that what the technicians did is "now standard operating procedure"; Fox accepted it without bitterness ("I can't even cry about that"). ## Attitudes & Aphorisms (Fox) - Hates the phrase "it's not personal, it's business": **"If your business isn't personal to you, get the hell out of what you're doing."** - "Love many, trust few, always paddle your own canoe" — a good way to run a business or a life. - Advice to the younger generation: make the most of where you land, don't bounce job to job, don't whine — **a callback is "a second chance," not a burden**; put yourself in the customer's shoes. - Never considered quitting despite lean early years (living off a credit card, driving a beat-up Honda Civic, friends questioning his move from white-collar work). - On grit: "I won a lot of fights that I really lost... if you don't give up... if you can't beat them with your intelligence, maybe I can beat them with my grit." ## Host Contributions (Paul Giannamore) - Framed Presto as **one of the largest pure-play commercial pest control companies in the United States** with ~98% recurring revenue, built with no salespeople. - Recalled first meeting Fox in 2020 in Philadelphia (King of Prussia area) and witnessing the technician relationship-building firsthand. - Stated his own motivation: seeing founders' happiness after a sale is "one of the most gratifying parts of my job... this is why I do what I do." - Called Fox's story "kind of a Shawshank Redemption story — you crawled through a lot of [__] over the years." - Asked a joking question about Fox's parents' marriage that led to a comedic break ("We'll be right back"). ## Post-Sale Reflection (Fox) - Selling felt like the right timing; the business had been "another one of your children," but after a year out, "the timing was perfect... I'm feeling wonderful." - Credited Giannamore's team: the process "without your help would have been impossible... you made it actually enjoyable." - On the whole: "Did the means justify the end? I don't know, but right now where I'm sitting, life is good." ## Qualifications & Tensions Preserved - Fox simultaneously calls the growth-at-all-costs years not exactly a mistake ("I don't even necessarily call it a mistake") while lamenting not prioritizing cash flow sooner ("why didn't I do this years ago"). - He expresses pride in the business and its sale alongside acknowledged personal costs: two divorces, years of hotel living, and the criminal indictment. - His claim of never knowing about the misapplied pesticides stands alongside his guilty plea and admission of failed oversight. # Speaker Attribution Record — Video 01a168c8-c167-7ecc-81f2-a57cdf4eb482 ## Video Overview - **Title:** *Ken Fox of Presto Pest Control | Off The Record With Paul Giannamore* - **Format:** In-person interview conducted in San Juan, Puerto Rico (video, face-to-face rather than audio-only — referenced explicitly by both participants). ## Speakers and Roles | Speaker | Role | Attribution Basis | |---|---|---| | **Paul Giannamore** | Host / creator; also identified as the advisor who assisted with Ken Fox's business sale ("the process without your help would have been impossible") | Named in title and self-referenced throughout | | **Ken Fox** | Guest; founder and former owner of Presto Pest Control; sold the company ~1 year prior to recording | Named in title and addressed directly by host | ### Mentioned Non-Speaking Persons (context only, not speakers) - **Barbara/Barbie** — Ken Fox's girlfriend, referenced by both speakers. - **Franco** — mentioned by Paul Giannamore as part of his team ("you and Franco as a team"). - **Natalie, Eric** — Ken Fox's children; **Arabella** — upcoming grandchild. - Ken Fox's parents (ages 89 and 91) — described, not speaking. ## Provenance and Source Facts (as stated by speakers) ### Business/Transactional Claims - Ken Fox states he **sold Presto to Thompson Street Capital Partners** ("Pesco portfolio"), approximately one year before recording (referenced as "September 21st"). - Host characterizes Presto as "one of the largest Pure Play commercial pest control companies in the United States" — third-party characterization within the interview, uncontested. - Competitors named by host in a hypothetical: **Orkin, Terminix** (transcribed phonetically as "runica" — uncertain rendering). ### First-Party Claims by Guest (unverified) - No sales personnel employed; technician compensation structure (25–30% of route revenue); no line of credit used despite growth. - A **2008 legal case**: indicted on five counts related to pesticide misapplication by technicians; pled guilty to one charge, paid a fine, withdrew from the unnamed state; record later expunged per agreement. - COVID-19 operations: furloughed roughly one-third of workforce; returned to profitability by summer 2020. ### Personal Claims by Guest (unverified) - Two divorces; children aged 22 and 18; grandchild expected; prior career in radio and as a substitute TV host on a Philadelphia dance program (1985). ## Promotional Segments - **None identified.** No explicit promotional, sponsorship, or product-placement segments are present in the transcript. A beverage is consumed on camera ("Tony Sofrito pick the scotch") without clear promotional framing — noted as **uncertain**, not flagged as promotion. ## Curated Metadata - **Not supplied.** No speaker metadata, comment availability, or curated provenance was provided beyond the raw transcript. ## Uncertainty Notes - Transcript begins with the token "foreign" — no attributable content. - Some proper nouns are phonetically uncertain in the transcript (e.g., "Pesco," "runica," "the Mexican" as an apparent nickname for Paul used by Ken Fox). - Statements of fact above are recorded **as claims by the speakers**, not independently verified. foreign Ken Fox welcome to San Juan Puerto Rico pleasure to be here you know this is an episode that I've literally been waiting for a year to do and when you and I had a discussion a couple of months ago I said we can do this on audio but we can do this live in San Juan and you said the people demand this space so here we are with a man who's old enough to be my biological father that's true yeah it looks about my age right well thank you for the why but continue it's great to have you and you know it's funny Ken I think we have to talk about this you are down here with your girlfriend you being Ken Fox she being Barbie so we have Ken and Barbie can you believe that and you believe that you really believe it I didn't I I didn't believe until I saw with my own eyes actually true yep the animal anatomically correct Ken and Barbie dolls so Ken and Barbie down in Puerto Rico well thanks for coming down again I have been super excited to do this episode yeah me too Ken you sold presto to Thompson Street Capital Partners Pesco portfolio last we're coming up in a year September 21st it's just a little over a year ago today how does it feel remarkable yeah um it's surprising in many aspects too how I feel yeah um you know as a as a Founder person that starts it by yourself building it up um there is um there's an emotional attachment as almost it's another one of your children it's your business uh however when the tide came which inevitably comes it does um the process without your help would have been impossible you made it easy uh you made it actually enjoyable it was fun um as I may say but afterwards being out of it for that time I got to realize the timing was perfect uh the emotional involvement as to I'm I'm not involved with it and initiate the day-to-day aspect of the business anymore I'm feeling wonderful it was sometimes timing is everything and timing was very good for me well you look about six months younger so back for a second so you you started this business I know actually on the way here this morning you were talking about the fact that you were in Puerto Rico in 1979 1979 but when did you start this business and your story is actually just a it's the most entertaining story in Pest Control going all the way back so I want to talk about your teams your time on radio your time on TV right time in the pest control Vineyards so take us back all right um I I had to pay my way through school through college went to Temple University I was a broadcast major radio television and film and uh had to do what I had to do to earn money to uh pay for my tuition my books and beer money so to speak and so I I worked in radio beginning uh as a teenager part-time at night at various stations in the Philadelphia area and at the same time uh during the Summers I worked in Pest Control and uh continued to do that until I graduated from college and then I started a career in behind the scenes and broadcasting with advertising sales up and it worked up in New York in Philadelphia and in New York always had that love of the Horatio Elder Story the rags to riches story wanted to do something myself and didn't have a rich Uncle to hook up with and started join his business so uh Pest Control is what I knew I knew how to do it I had ideas when I was doing as everybody does in Pest Control how did you know how to do it like were you working for somebody part time when you were in school yeah exactly working for it back part-time and um uh had I I always enjoyed I did some I actually served some commercial Accounts at the time mostly it was residential it was just general pest control and um told my boss that gave my two weeks I wanted to start my business back in my hometown of Philadelphia and I think they thought I was clinically nuts and maybe I needed an r r some time off and rethink this and they said you want to leave all this to become an exterminator is what they said to me my boss's boss came in and um unfortunately I was young and dumb at the time I wasn't even aware of some of the the problems that could occur when you start a business I went into a pretty naively and without even a real clear business plan I was in my 20s but I want it to strike out on my own and um the business evolved eventually from mainly residential I just got customers the good old-fashioned way I mean literally knocked on doors I had to survive and I wanted to chase a dream and sometimes when you have the motivation and you have the desire and you wonder where your next dollar is going to come from you'll do anything to make sure you succeed that's that was that was the Genesis of my company so were you I mean I guess for a period of time you were in the broadcast space while doing pest control and then how did you end up at I do remember a lot of funny stories told about you being on TV well here's what happened is I I contact when I started my company uh I just contacted everybody that I knew hey do you need pest control services and some of the people that I contacted were people that I knew in the broadcasting industry I have to service a local TV station in Philadelphia that had a a local dance show much like an American Bandstand type program and uh that was I was in there had my first employee at the time maybe he was with me just a week and I'm taking him around the station to show him we service this area we service that area I walked into accidentally into a middle of a conference meeting and it was a production stamp at this TV show one of the men in the meeting came up to me after the meeting came up to me and said aren't you Ken Fox and I said yeah he remembered me when I worked on radio years earlier and he said it was good to see you and he said well what are you doing now and I said I'm an exterminator he said no really what are you doing now I always thought you had a great sense of humor he's like no I really can and I said I said I'm an exterminator and I said I have this business and uh this is my new employee and my new employee obviously didn't know of anything in my past life what I did and long story short is that he said you want to try it again we have the show it's on from four to five if you have your own business we have a host sometimes if he can't make it in or we need a substitute host or a co-host uh be perfect you'd be the perfect ideal candidate and you can still run your business yep sure enough a few weeks later uh maybe a month later I don't know exactly how much I got a call they needed somebody the host could make it for a live program and at that time it was 1985 put on my best Miami Vice clothes got down there and uh did the show live and then started doing more and more of the programs yeah and I'm running the pest control business during the daytime now I have actually seen clips from this my apology and I'm sorry to subject you to those I thought they were fantastic okay so you're doing this show and you're still doing pest control on the pest control is your main job that was your main business right your business right did you call it Presto at the time uh no had another name and uh at the time before I incorporated into Presto because I had some thoughts about why I wanted to change the philosophy of the company okay yeah so you're doing you're you're on TV you're doing Pest Control were you ever recognized as a yeah it was and I I I there's a pretty funny story as you know um I do the show was live Monday Tuesday and Wednesdays after Thursday's show up for Thursday's show they would tape that after Monday's show okay and Friday's show they would tape after Tuesday's show but the opening of the show we started out with live from Philadelphia yeah well actually it wasn't live on Thursday and Friday so it had to be a Thursday or Friday and a performing residential Pest Control had to be four o'clock because as I'm upstairs performing a pest control routine pest control services you're also performing on TV I heard my voice on downstairs I heard myself one the lady is watching the show and I could hear her coming up the steps and I'm going oh boy here we go and um she has her hands on her hips and I'm spraying underneath her bed and looking underneath there and she said I see her and I felt what felt like going yeah it's me I'm a famous TV star too and uh she said what did you say your name was and I said Ken and she said Ken what and I said Ken Fox and I was about ready to say yeah that's me but she said you gotta see this and she grabs me by the arm I went downstairs watching the TV set and she says to me look at that guy not only does he have the same name as you he looks exactly like you and he sounds like you and I went oh man I said I Feel Like This Woman's gonna hit me over the head with a lamp if I now say it's me and I said yeah I hear that all the time and I said I can see the resemblance did she not make the connection because of how much weight the camera puts on a not a person possibly yes possibly a much more better looking in person that's what I would imagine Ken Fox to say like the TV didn't do you justice so how to do that whole on Philadelphia live it was a short stint in 1985 but it was just kind of funny but it real I realized then is that no matter what I was working again for somebody else and it wasn't I wouldn't I was starting to change the the emphasis ever so slightly getting away from more of the residential ending concentrating more on the commercial sector and I really wanted to chase that dream I want to talk about how you took that business from you and your helper and your part-time broadcast program to you know the the origin or the Genesis I should say of presto so how did this all happen that's why I changed the name of the business of presto and I think we all can relate you call a service provider whether it's residential or commercial and you um you have this um you you make a service call you may not get a call back till the next day and they can make it out a week later and they're lucky if they show up with an idea point of time people and obviously people want good quality service and they're willing to pay a price for it if it's a good value but people want things done right away and in Pest Control the phone doesn't ring because they want to say hello to you they've got a problem they want it solved like that yep so I thought Presto is a good name is a good name it signifies what we're about yeah I had a philosophy that every phone call every email every message will be returned in under an hour regardless it's going to be returned and I had a slogan in my office I said play a play turning the the old uh expression upside down saying the only thing that come to those who wait is stuff that nobody else wanted and people want it now and uh that alone is is is part of the part of the foundation of presto getting giving good fast Quick Service you know I like to use humor in everyday life because that's me some not everybody has to be a comedian but I also believe in being a realness with your customers give that polite deferential service but let the real you come through too while you're servicing it you know you don't have to be a robot uh enjoy what you're doing when you're out there every day because when the time comes and we go to the great beyond it's not going to have your name and real nice guy it's going to have your name and your occupation after it almost all the time yep so that defines who you are your occupation your career and I thought well if that's the way I'm going to go I'm going to make sure that uh I do the best I can during that time it's at least a third of your life you're spending in a career how did you you know as you grew that business how did you have everyone live up to that whole Presto Mantra which is we return we're back in an hour like calls emails whatever we're back to our clients I've hired people that most people wouldn't think of hiring wow Presto had uh assistant school people that were assistant school principals district managers of restaurants that made darn good salaries uh people that were retired Health uh uh inspectors people that I could use their resources to be out there on the job I also made sure that we had no sales we had growth some years of 30 or more 40 in some years uh but what we did was the whole the whole idea that we had not one sales person ever in the company and we had phenomenal growth but the way we did it was is that we built the business exactly the way I did it when I was by myself or just a few employees what I would do is is that um I would suppose I have an employee hired I wake up on a Monday morning that person is fully trained I would go out the door in a service vehicle and knock on doors and build a route that way go up and down blocks and look at restaurants bakeries pharmaceutical plants movie theaters anything that was a business hairdressing salons anything and then once I got that route up to a very small amount I mean only hundreds of dollars a week in Revenue I was always at the same time looking for another person to hire who's going to take over that route when I found I always call the person we hired Prince Charming that's the right person for the job you can train anybody to become a good Pest Control person but you can't train a person how what kind of a person to be you would take that person show them what I did knock on those doers build the business we're going to pay you more than this route is bringing in in the beginning give them a good salary train them the best you can and then go out there and then they will service maybe only one two three hours a day the rest of the day they're either doing one of two things building the business up or going out and visiting the existing customers and seeing how they're doing that would build no technician in Presto was supposed to work more than six hours a day servicing the other two hours they were supposed to go back we internally called Tech options was the option of the technician to go out the tech op Tech member yep and go out and visit those accounts that weren't being serviced that week stop in and say hey how you doing because you may be going in there two in the afternoon when the owner of the diner isn't in yet that you're servicing and he doesn't know who you are but if you saw a mouse running across the floor at 10 in the morning he would say oh fire Presto go get it's it's at that point it's just a nameless faceless company that he has he never sees in the morning that's servicing the place and instead Bill who is the service technician goes and meets the owner of the diner at two o'clock shakes his hand says I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart and mean it and look the guy in the eye when you say that and say thanks for the business I really appreciate it you put food on my table I'll do anything to keep you happy I just wanted to thank you and while I'm here let me check some things out make sure everything is okay so I need to break this down for a second because he said a lot you you effectively grew one of the largest pure if you think about it Ken you grew one of the largest Pure Play commercial pest control companies in the United States and you had no sales people not one not one and you did that because everyone in your company was selling and if I understand you correctly your commercial techs would service for six hours in a day the additional two hours was out there to build relationships with their customers and you call that Tech opportunity so I'm your technician I actually I remember sitting in Philly I mean I'm a I'm not I'm not originally from Philly but I spent years there I know I remember you and I hanging out in Center City we were right off right now Square we were right at where were we we were a restaurant we were as a Stephen Star Restaurant and I remember you literally showing me live how this all works your technician walks in spend some time with the manager spent some time with some of the other folks working there builds a relationship with the team there and tries to understand what what else they need a kind of in a nutshell were they bringing anything with them when your technicians would show up would they bring anything any materials no they all everybody was required nobody could carry their spray tank out in the open why let's talk about that sends it sends a bad message because you suppose you're going to work every day you're you're going to the office not to pass a pest control I'm talking to anybody we're driving down the street and suppose this restaurant that we were he drives by this restaurant that's a cline of ours and every eight at eight o'clock every Tuesday morning or every other Tuesday morning the technician was scheduled to be out there and every time that the uh every now and then and it happens week after week this this person driving by says she's an exterminator pest control guy going into the restaurant because that silver tank is a warning sign to people forget the truck the vehicle it's for some reason you could have your name emblazoned on the side of the truck that doesn't that doesn't send red signal alerts to that those people but that spray tank does yeah and so the guy may come home from White from work and talk to his wife she goes you know I would say in the past six to eight weeks I've seen the pest control guide an exterminator walking into that restaurant with a silver tank each hunt we're never eating there again just send a bad message however most restaurants uh in the United States are required by some type of ordinance to be uh treated and inspected by a commercially licensed pest control company at a certain period illness over a certain period of time so my technicians would walk in with their basic case and it was a uh it was called a BNG case is that we'd have it would have the tank in there but I have other materials too if they needed to do glue boards things you need to do on the spot of course their van had more other goods and other materials if they needed it but that was a requirement don't ever don't ever let the public see you with that spray tank in your hand then if you're never allowed to the public see them with a spray tank how did you want your Technique I mean how were your technicians to dress impeccably and I used to tell every one of my technicians we will purchase everything for you except your socks your underwear and your belt and uh pants were purchased they had to be well laundered and cleaned if they were stained if they were ripped we replaced we had a number we had uh warm weather shirts we had cold weather shirts uh require only certain types of shoes that we purchased for the technicians that were slip proof shoes that wouldn't fall and hurt themselves uh hats they wear everything they they couldn't wear sports teams had they were the Presto had it was it was almost in the middle in the military you don't expect to see somebody wearing their favorite sports teams hat we provided all the clothing uh that the technician could want so I understand I'm a commercial Tech I'm doing my services I've got my tech up time I'm spending it with my client but what about I mean how do I grow my route use that time those during that you can if you want to spend more more than two hours out there a day and keep on going and if you feel like you're on a roll too we weren't looking for people with the gift of God necessarily we wanted people that were real again nothing when that person that technician came to the door he would have basic a basic handout marketing piece would try to get in there and just say Let me let me give you a free proposal do you have any issues you'd like to talk about I'd love to have your business to speak from the heart so how but how does that work so so I'm a technician and I've got my route I want to grow it I want to make more money so I walk into a place across the street what do I say I was working I just says work tell them where you were working why you're there and uh and be aware this technician now has been working for a full day he's not dressed in a Fortune 500 type suit he looks like he's he's been working he's a little dirty yep that that doesn't turn people off when somebody sees somebody out there that their hair's peckable impeccable they're dressed to the knights and they're selling pest control that doesn't compute and the guy and the person that's being approached might just keep saying himself just say no just say no just say no but really this is this is like if the plumber came to your door and said hey I was down the street here's here's a here's a flyer if you ever have a clogged drain or something give me a call this will work in any service business when you think about it ours is a recurring business recurring Revenue business model so this technician there wasn't that wall that was put up right away we provided tremendous commission structure for the technicians too if they got that customer the great thing thing is too that technician service and he could say that you know he could sell that that piece of business he's going to be the same person that's going to show up there week after week month after month servicing that account so it's not as though as some salesman sells it and disappears so what about what about I walk across the street I talked to a guy and he says hey Paul thanks for stopping in you seem like a nice guy but I use orc and I use Terminix I use runica we got our own pest control guy I don't need you what do I say that's great I hope everything's good I hope everything is fine if you know what it's it's if you throw enough stuff up something's going to stick in in Pest Control somebody's going to need your service somebody's going to be a little frustrated that the problem hasn't been solved somebody's going to be the technician is uh just not their cup of tea they're not showing up on it we're methodical in our route building if we were there Tuesday at eight it was every Tuesday or every other Tuesday at eight we were there or they could know when we would be there uh the scheduling was done ahead of time you never had to call but if somebody says you know we're happy that's wonderful make a great impression don't be pushy you know there's there's more efficiency and they know your name well here's here's my information never leave a business card I said too because they have business cards you guys uh yeah do you remember when we first met and when we first met at uh Park and I said here's my card and you and Franco looked at me and uh you said I was a little old being polite you said I was a little old school with the cards but you did but that's okay but the fact is don't just we had a little marketing piece that they could keep handy and I said use a red marker and write your name and your company cell phone number there too that shows up that's it if you ever need us give us a call uh if you if you have a situation that arises that uh there's a issue and you need somebody right away and your company isn't out there remind them it's Presto we'll be out there you'll hear from us right away we will be out there that day our technicians also uh had a great Compensation Plan we I had to compete to pay a person that was making what they did as an assistant principal at a high school uh as a district manager for restaurants and uh a six-figure salary was not uncommon at presto let's talk about how did you compensate these people in the beginning it was a salary structure uh or hourly structure in the beginning for a trainee or a new person in the for the most part however sometimes you would get somebody that had a lot of experiencing it uh to reap to take over an existing route we could we could make uh we could allow for that a technician once they built up the route to a certain point it's very simple it and other people would roll their eyes in the industry and look at me how can you afford that I said how can I afford not to I have virtually no turnover and I would pay a registered technician that wasn't fully licensed 25 percent of the of the grocery seats of the route and uh certified tech 30 percent of the grocery seats of around so if a route is making is bringing in eight thousand dollars a week in Revenue which is not uncommon in an urban high density round that technician is now making 2400 a week which translates roughly to about 130 000 a year that's pest control and they didn't work weekends they didn't work nights it worked and they stayed with that job they were home to see their kids they started early so they were home by three o'clock in the afternoon got to see their kids home from school your technicians had a great lifestyle but if I recall you know you being the business owner wasn't always you know weekends and no nights I want to talk about that over time yeah yeah it's not handed to you yeah let's talk about yeah how that went well it um they talk about uh you can have it all well that's probably maybe true for some people uh for me it wasn't um uh you know there there's collateral damage sometimes when you uh when you're all in on your career and uh in in order for me to expand my business into other markets from Philadelphia to Baltimore to Washington to Richmond I moved down into those markets and uh lives in a hotel during the week and um essentially many for years came home on the weekends I was out there in a service vehicle when I had when I started a new market I would drive into Richmond with not a customer and I did the same process all over again yeah and um you know it there was I I my biggest failure in my life is and it's not all we're not we're here to expose everything warts and all and you know I went through two divorces and I come from a line a family that's never had a divorce I come from a very close you like to be first in your family apparently oh yeah I wanted to be first a lot of a lot of cases that wasn't it but it is what it is and um uh you know those those are some of the collateral damages that occur uh so you you got married your first marriage you were quite young you and your 23 is that right do I remember I was 11. I had a tricycle with the pest control but you were in your early 20s right that's when you got married so you got married how long after you got married before you had children um I was 26 27. mommy well my daughter was born and this is while in the early years of presto that was when it was still located in Philadelphia that was it but I yeah but then again I I can go back and I I'm sure a lot of other business owners are not just in Pest Control I remember working on thanksgivings because hey businesses are closed they can go in there back then fogging was big I can get in there and do do work that I normally can't get done yeah uh I was all in and I didn't nickname that my uncle gave to me when I was a child was Kenny overdo it and uh I think you can I can you can you know what I'm talking about but um you know if if I I if I can't beat them with my intelligence and uh maybe I can beat them with my grit and it does work yeah you know and boy oh boy you get smarter as you keep going on too while everybody else is is falling to the Wayside you keep going and you learn these things you learn hey I did this wrong this works you know you you get better as you get sharper as you go along and it was fun yeah it was fun I enjoyed going out into the arena every day I really did that's one thing I do miss still the the day-to-day so that took its toll you being on the road you being always on always something's got to give yeah so in the early years for you that put stress on your marriage yeah it did and um I'm certainly not the only person to go through that but uh you know it's that's it became a it became a diversion for my marriage I guess it's the best way to put it yeah and um it is what it is at this point I'm I'm 66 now so I look back on my I start looking back on my life and um those are what I've done things differently I don't know um but you you had two children right first marriage correct first marriage and then I call them the little guys because I see you you're in your 60s you've got a 21 year old daughter and it just turned Natalie just turned 22. 22. yeah she's getting old again I guess it's another year now I know she's 22 and your son was 18. so is he 19 now he's he's 18. okay yeah Eric is 18. yeah and you now are I mean you're like the greatest father ever I mean you spend a ton of time with these kids yeah you I love my children yeah you're going to Temple visiting your daughter embarrassing her in front of her friends same thing with her son yep yes yep my son is uh uh going to college and also is a student pilot because he wants to become a pilot I remember what you're saying yeah and uh it just it may not be there with them now but we talk if not a couple times today but we do talk daily and uh get to see him as much as I can on the road to you seeing them as much as you can it was 2020 you and I met you're running a commercial business which is a really shitty business to be running in the depths of covid especially when they close everything right so what happened in you know March of 2020 what was going through your mind is that when you really ramped up the drug usage or what well yes called Scarface and I said bring more supplies in um but you know what you know the old expression when uh oops sorry about that when life hands you a lemon you make lemonade and um our organization grew quite large uh managers regional managers uh and and uh so we literally shut down uh even though people still showed up at the office they know place to go uh they they had to come in and we shut down literally for one or two days then we said we have to get we have you know we have large-scale commercial accounts where we started operations right away that within Tuesday afternoon we're back maybe Monday morning where let's put a pause and everything and rethink we kept rethinking as we start reopening every organization has its go-getters of people that just make everything work smoothly and then you have the cancer in the in the locker room type of mentality and every business owners and you try your best and do your best hiring yep and um there is hockey has are you familiar with the plus minus no in hockey hockey rates each of its players this way is that when a player and individual players on the ice does that team score more goals or do they give up more goals and I just love that it was something great does that person a positive or A negative to the organization so we had an opportunity we I always over employed too that was another more boots on the street the more business we got that's the way we worked and uh had conversations with the managers and um we were as we were bringing people back off from layoff I mean this was within before the first week is up there was already managers are saying I went I went these two guys right away back right away I went these these guys and I said well who don't you want back and the names came out and probably about one-third of the workforce we found out not only could we operate we operate without those people we operated much more efficiently and the compensation plan for the people in the field was based upon what you produced in the field suddenly people are their incomes zoomed uh we had didn't have the people that were slowing down the organization and what we found and the the and as you saw the numbers we always made a profit I wasn't but that wasn't my key goal my key goal all along was grow grow baby grow this is great we're we're taking on the big boys and beating them all the time now we found an organization that's extremely profitable we only had the team players on board and we were making a phenomenal profit I saw that already in 2020 and it happened by the summer of 2020 we were fully back in in gear that's when I contacted you in September two years ago and I said you know it's my business worth and uh but that's how the that's how covet what covet did for us it actually was a it was the best thing that ever happened to this company you know when I think about your business historically I mean you've always taken a good salary for yourself but at the end of the day you were focused on growth Top Line growth you want it to be huge you continue to grow your staff and like you said it was covid that really made you say okay who are the real producers who can we call from this organization but what did you learn about when you went through that whole sell side process what did you learn about cash flow versus you know in this industry everyone thinks about Revenue multiples and your business was largely recurring I mean your business 100 recovery 98 recur I mean you guys were just selling so you had that right you had high gross margins but you were constantly reinvesting in that business what what sort of things did you learn about cash flow as you went through that process you're talking about what did I learn after the cash flow really increased yes what did you yes what did you learn why didn't I do this when I was 40 years old probably but um it it gave me a new perspective on running the business it also gave me an opportunity believe it or not I I had a much more the business is its people did they buy it or not I had now a a a a a a staff that was 100 bought in and every business owner with a sizable employee base would love that and I it made things easy for me and as I not only did I realize that I always as I got bigger I delegated fairly well uh as time went along I had better at delegating but here I really could tell you because I could trust everybody I knew everybody was doing their job and I sat back and I realized how important it was it was you hear about good cash flow in a business and um uh it really it finally hit home to me that boy why did I why did I do this years ago but nonetheless you can't go back in time as many other mistakes I don't even necessarily called it was a mistake I threw everything I had I had every resource bottom line wasn't important to me in those years it was just if I had some extra extra Revenue uh money in the bank we'd hire one or two more people we had times where we purchased four or five Vans at a time and go on a hiring spree and uh at a hotel we'd have a job fair and hire two three new people in a market yep and uh those were and this is a company that started with no line of credit we eventually got lines of credit I'm proud to say that we never ever had to use them and we still had that growth no sales people we kind of turned the company on it and we only had we had 11 service operation areas we only had one main office in another office in between Baltimore and Washington all the others and we everybody essentially operate remotely yeah before that became the term because they're running routes and you go out the door you know where you have to be on a Monday morning at seven o'clock or six o'clock what do you think you know now in retrospect being relaxed retired looking 10 years younger what were some of the biggest challenges you've had to overcome over the years in growing this business for decades well as you know there was um um when you're and people that have a business back in in the uh mid 2000s 2007 business which I mean 30 40 maybe even 50 growth it was just phenomenal we're expanding in into different states hiring managers uh you start to lose some Focus or you don't delegate or you grow too quick and you're not paying attention to the finer details uh we had a situation in in 2008 where um there were some technicians uh in in one of the states that um were applying uh material that should off-label that and a disgruntled employee uh who I I'm sad to say I I met only on one occasion with hiring was completely I got I got more involved in hiring after this was I let the company was disgruntled and took it out on his manager and decided to let uh the state Regulators know that what was going on in terms of the misapplication of pesticides and the wall in that state was very clear is that those are in charge or responsible for the conduct of us are responsible and it goes right up to me yeah um and um that was to say one of the worst times in my life is an understatement it was I was ultimately indicted with five counts and each count was the same for each technician there were five technicians that were found to have misapplied pesticides um I found good legal help and I cooperated I pled guilty to one of the charges from one of the and um I was put I had to I had to get a mug shot uh I had to plead guilty in a superior court and I had to make an agreement ultimately to leave the state if no more charges to be forthcoming I just wanted nothing might flag it I won't say the state here but I'll just say that my flag only has 49 Stars but uh mine too but I uh same state okay okay I just never liked that state in general well so um so uh I learned a lesson you know I never was involved with the pesticide usage I never was I never knew that this wasn't being applied and all I was looking at was the chemical purchases on it and I thought the numbers look like they're within range well that had to change luckily for me I will go on a little bit further in my defense is that uh I was able to uh if I was a good boy for a year all charges would be the record was expunged as if it never occurred but it I had to pay a fine I had to pull out of that state which wasn't my largest operating state by far but it's still it still hurt me I had future plans for that and but it taught me a valuable lesson and uh one of the valuable lessons if you went remember I said earlier about great so I got I got kicked in the teeth I got knocked down you got to get back up and we continued to grow uh after we after we got people in the office that were Finance directors got better qualified people to become managers in in the company and uh I made sure that uh the people that I'm always dependent upon people out there I knew I could depend on good quality people how does it make you feel that what your guys were ultimately charged with and what responsibly fell on you and you were charged with is now normal operating procedure now everything that they did before was is now a standard way to do this now now it's okay I you know what um so I guess if somebody was arrested for marijuana right exactly 10 years ago or 15 years ago whenever before it changed that's just the way it goes I can't even cry about that do you remember the old expression is that uh I I told you many times loved one yes trust few always yes and that's the way you should run your business and at the end of the day um you know I think that's a good way to run your own business too regardless in your profession too whether you're whether you're an employee or an owner or professor at school or a doctor a lawyer or you're a pest control operator I think that's just a good way to run your business how did you learn to do what I think is very difficult for many owners which is to delegate effectively that's that's you worded that exactly right there's how does an owner learn to delegate and how does an owner learn then to delegate effectively two-step alert yeah that situation I had in that state was a two-step learning process I delegated yeah but I didn't delegate effectively that's on me but how do you I mean how did you learn to do that over time because you can you're you're definitely you want to be in control you wanted to be in control like I remember working with you and one of the things in the Mexican liked about you he's like Ken super old but he's always on just like me where is he there he is get that Mexican over here he's like yeah he's like Ken's super old but he's always on Franco look at this this is you in 30 years dude that's even five years Gary the way now and they give me the truth serum exactly cheers by the way cheers great to see you down here again I'm so happy you guys sure make it yeah it was and you and Franco as a team were always great I found that you guys like burgers too we do I mean Franco actually wanted us to talk about we were up in so for those who know the Philadelphia region we were in King of Prussia and you you actually I know you spent your time in Florida now but you're from that area are you from Doylestown well you were living in Doylestown I I I I I have a home near Doylestown um I Live Now uh Barbara and I Live Now in Westchester during getting old now during the warmer months and we'll she's been the winners you sober up in Philly yes with the Woody toy all right so you guys are snowbirds yes yeah I have a grandchild of coming this January so when so we'll be uh facing the cold weather somehow that's super exciting now this isn't your first grandchild no it's not but this will be a special grandchild because she's your little baby Natalie's youngest daughter yes how does that feel um you know um I can I can her name I just found out last night my daughter picked a name it's a girl it's Arabella congratulations yeah and um I was just saying to Barbara last night I am it's it's it's you know man I've always been family oriented you guys would call me I always had the kids with me or you know if it was free time and and I always apologize when you would take calls on speakerphone with a Mexican when your kids are in the car kids were used to it they knew that Dad was go go go take over the world man you're running out of time um and I don't want to get too emotional here because families and my mom and dad are still my dad God bless him he's gonna be 91. your parents are better than you and they're in their nine your mom's what 89. she's exactly she's 89 91 91. he'll be 91. and they look like they're 60. they're they're they're my heroes and they and I actually have said that in cars they're my heroes yeah they have stayed married they're still deeply in love my father is a great husband my mother is a great wife yeah and they're both great parents how do you think their sex life is we'll be right back thanks Paul I wouldn't ask anyone other than Ken Fox that question you're the only one on the planet I would have said that to well if it's anything like mine it's fantastic no I know you're close to your parents I know you're I mean you talked about them throughout they look super young they're very active I know your mom recently had a hip problem she did she fell and broke her hip last year she's a retired registered nurse and she's uh now has gotten an MMA fighting I just want to see if you're listening but she's doing well uh they're both very active my dad goes to the gym three times a week phenomenal um and um it just it talk to them constantly and uh they are snowbirds themselves too they're up in Pennsylvania and it's um see them a lot talk to them all the time and uh you know when you and and I don't say that term lightly when this person is here you try to Aspire them very first person I call I was when I sold the business last year I was 65 years old I'm still afraid of my dad a little bit yeah you know he raised me right I wanted I want to do right by my parents I think but I think that's a good thing as soon as the deal was done very first person I call was my father second person I calls Barbara and uh but I just wanted to let my parents hey you did okay and your boy did all right you know and um and thanks for hanging in on those bumps because when you're a close family you go the whole fat when you go through bumps everybody everyone's being with you and um you know another line you know I have all these lines I know and that's where I come to this line one of my a line that makes me sick is somebody if you lost the business if you lost an account and they would say hey it's not personal it's business I hate that line if your business isn't personal to you get the hell out of what you're doing yeah again like I said earlier it's one third of your life I don't make it I mean it has to run you emotionally and you're a basket case but you better care about it you better not stop thinking about just because it's five o'clock you stop thinking about it uh you always it should be something that goes through your mind uh you will really really get much more sense of an enjoyment satisfaction and a sense of fulfillment that that that what you're doing no matter what it is whether you're an owner or whether you're an employee that that is coursing through your veins constantly that you give a damn about what you do people will see that and feel that so if you take a step back you know 20 years and look at the Ken Fox of today I mean how did everything turn out for you family business right everything great great you know you know um uh did the means justify the end I don't know but right now where I'm sitting life is good it really is I mean you're probably one of the happiest clients I've ever seen you sold that business you really delved deeper into family you've got a wonderful girlfriend your kids are doing your kids are doing great you gotta you're gonna be grandfather once again your parents are alive and Ticking at 89 and 91. yeah so things are really good for you and you're down here in Puerto Rico hanging out with us sorry say for the Mexican everything's good yeah well you got a thing to go with the band making sure that something's not flying across the room towards my head no you know I can't thank you guys enough I could not and and I'm not just blowing smoke up your your rear end I'm blowing smoke over here okay I and I mean that is that uh we all we all have something we're good at I wouldn't expect you to go into a restaurant and um be able to get rid of the Cockroaches or treat for cockroaches I wouldn't expect you even though you deal with Pest Control owners all day to sit in the seat of an owner's share a pest control company and run it effectively it's something you learn through the years could not have come close to doing anything that we accomplished together without the involvement of you guys it made it it tied a nice little you guys helped me tie a little nice little bow in my professional life it's one of the most gratifying parts of my job is to see how happy guys like you are when we finally cross that Finish Line yeah I mean it really is this is why I do you always say Paul you're flying around you're working so many hours why do you do what you do this is why I do what I do you love it to see these sorts of stories yeah yeah and I see it in you you know when we talk it's not just Monday through Fridays nine to five well you'll get a text on a Saturday night y'all you we had a conversation when I was in Florida by myself uh waiting to fly back and we went on for what probably would have been a 10-minute conversation or an hour and a half and we're just BS and on the phone yeah yeah that was something and so that's you're you come from that mindset you know it's it's you deal with people like that and you you you have a sense of fulfillment too that uh it's enjoyable to see I do what I do to have conversations with guys like you at the end of the day to see how these stories play out and and you did it man thank you in a lot of ways it's you're kind of a Shawshank Redemption story because you crawled through a lot of \[ \_\_ \] over the years to build that business up yeah you really did yeah and I um it's really spectacular Ken when you think about it I mean you legitimately own one of the largest Pure Play commercial pest control companies in the country and when you were crawling under cabinets doing your part-time broadcasting I guess you never imagined it huh never in a million years no what do you think I guess in retrospect to all of this if you if you were talking to the younger generation let's say I was the younger version of Ken Fox not clearly as good looking of course that's that's a given well what sort of advice would you give me uh you know I'm starting I wanna I'm doing a commercial Pest Control business would you would you tell me well listen when if you remember that you when I started my own business I didn't have a particular fondness for Pest Control no I didn't I didn't have a light the clouds didn't part and said you you were the chosen one to kill the Cockroaches of the earth no I just wanted to start my own business in the beginning I I wanted to make something to myself I wanted to be in control I wanted to I wanted to be that person could turn around when I'm an old man and here I am and say hey you did it you you made you made that Mark so my advice would be is that um where were you if you're starting out and where you maybe first to land may not be the place where you absolutely want to be but make the most of where you're at it sounds crazy but force yourself to enjoy it get into it you know if it you really can't do it then move on to something else but find something you can kind of stick to for a while I I find that too many people Bounce from job to job to job and um don't whine just enjoy the moments enjoy the bad stuff because they're learning opportunities I I used to tell my technicians it's not people start whining about a call back oh they they said they saw I got to go out because they saw a roads and I got to work an extra half hour I said that's not a call man that's called a second chance they could have just as easily picked up another phone of another question for the company and I I and and say Presto you're fired we're hiring the other pest control company so sign a callback it's a second chance for God's sakes you know these people are running a business and put yourself always in the customer's shoes was there ever a point along the way where you were going to quit did you ever think about just getting out of this business no there were there times that were rough yeah no but in the beginning when I'm I didn't have two nickels to rub together and I'm literally living off a credit card and it was just me in the beginning I'm driving a beat up old Honda Civic with the the worst lettering in the world on the side of the vehicle uh yeah you know people thought I was nuts I left a white collar job and uh back in the days when there was dursban and diason and and and you could smell the stuff on you when when you uh came home at night um yeah it was a it was culture shock and friends that saw me when I was dressed up looking nice in the suit and tie coming home and uh crawling in crawl spaces to kill cockroaches thought I was you know you need a little help can you all right why are you doing this and um it's grit will overcome anything I grew up in I don't want to say in the streets of Northeast Philly an okay upbringing in the city uh I certainly by any means wasn't Rich by any means working class but I was always on the smaller side as a kid puberty hit me much later than most I think I was 42. um but my point being is that uh that Kenny overdo it so I had to overcompensate and I you're getting a lot of scraps especially when you're a boy in the city you know and I won a lot of fights that I really lost and what I mean by that is you're getting scrapes when you're when you're a boy 10 11 12 years old 13 years old and you have to assert yourself and people that live in the city understand that and sometimes the last guy standing wins you could have the crap beat out of you the other guy really got the best of you but if you keep standing take the teeth out throw them and keep going at them he's saying this guy won't give up if you don't give up sort of being a lunatic but I mean if you you apply that to business you apply that if you're a student in school you apply that to Hobbies don't give up if you're chasing something be able to go the distance and Beyond and don't waste a second suck life for all it's got man you know because you don't know when your ticket's gonna be checked amen you know and just just go for it well hope is you live as long as your father and God bless you can be half as good a man as him too yeah absolutely I can absolutely we can again I I've been looking forward to this for a year and we've tried to get you to do audio and we know the people demanded this face they're demanding so the public clamored for it they clamored for it we got it I don't blame them one bit we got it so thank you Ken cheers again what is this what am I drinking what are you lacing me with this is Tony Sofrito pick the scotch out I don't know what we're drinking but um I guess that's a wrap on the uh Ken Fox session okay my pleasure it's been fun awesome I really appreciate it oh thank you