A live interview from PestWorld 2023 in Honolulu with Mat Rogers, CEO of Lizard Marketing, part of Potomac TV's "Off the Record" series hosted by Paul Giannamore. Topics relate to pest control industry marketing and M&A, per the title and hashtags. # Channel Presentation Observations: "Lizard Marketing CEO Mat Rogers | Live from PestWorld 2023" ## Format & Presentation Style - This is a **live, on-location interview show** conducted at an industry event (PestWorld 2023, apparently in Hawaii). Evidence: title, and the guest noting, "I know you didn't even know you were on the docket today we just popped on stage." - The host runs **informal, conversational, profanity-laced interviews** with industry figures, mixing business talk with personal banter. Evidence: extended joking about "redneck" classifications, tattoos/tequila, flipping people off, and "Rogers [expletive] Amazing Homeschool." - The host references prior episodes and a series continuity. Evidence: "this is the followup from the Puerto Rico session" and "we've answered I'm glad we've done this followup." ## Intended Audience - **Pest control industry professionals and business owners**, addressed directly at points. Evidence: "everybody all of your pest control companies that are listening." - The audience appears to include listeners familiar with recurring industry figures. Evidence: "everyone knows Mike and Debbie Rogers anyone that listens to the buzz does for sure" — implying a regular listener base ("the buzz," likely a podcast/show reference). - International industry listeners are demonstrated. Evidence: "we had Phil Taylor the Australian guy... he said that he listens to the buzz." ## Claimed / Demonstrated Scope - The show covers **pest control business marketing, operations, and industry trends**. Evidence: discussion of LSAs ("most of the PCOS that we talk to tell us LSA is not working"), Google Business profiles, real estate as billboard strategy, and post-pandemic metrics. - Content also includes **personal profiles of industry leaders** (homeschooling, family, nonprofit work in Ethiopia, Killingsworth backstory). - Guests are typically **industry executives/marketing leaders** (here, the CEO of Lizard Marketing, a digital marketing agency for pest control companies). ## Tone & Creator Presentation Choices - The host presents as **irreverent and personal**, asking about family, faith, and lifestyle alongside business. Evidence: questions about LDS affiliation, the guest's children's GPAs, and "do you think you're going to cancel the Ethiopia trip?" - Casual production values are embraced rather than hidden. Evidence: opening lines "check oh shoot it's loud too." ## Explicit Self-Description Evidence - No explicit channel self-description (e.g., tagline or "about this channel" statement) appears in the title or transcript. Identity is conveyed implicitly through format, guest type, and audience address ("all of your pest control companies that are listening"). - The only explicit audience-facing claim is the indirect reference to the show/community name: "anyone that listens to the buzz" — suggesting the channel is known as "The Buzz" within the pest control community. ## Distinguishing Claims from Demonstration - **Creator-claimed:** Essentially none beyond the "buzz" listener reference; the host makes no direct statements about the channel's mission. - **Demonstrated patterns:** Event-based live interviews; pest control industry focus; marketing-heavy subject matter; established guest relationships with repeat appearances ("always a pleasure to see you"). # Delivery Observation: "Lizard Marketing CEO Mat Rogers | Live from PestWorld 2023" ## Format & Setting - **Unstructured live interview** recorded on a conference floor ("I know you didn't even know you were on the docket today we just popped on stage"), with an off-mic opening stumble: > "check oh shoot it's loud too" - **Casual, joking register throughout** — the interviewee engages in banter, e.g., > "I love you dad" and > "not that guy okay" (re: LDS conversion). ## Tone & Vocabulary - **Conversational, profanity-laced branding humor**: repeatedly names his homeschool the > "Rogers [ __ ] amazing homeschool" — a recurring verbal motif across the interview. - **Frequent filler hesitations**, especially when searching for words: > "uh uh uh", > "um um uh" — dense in the marketing-strategy sections. - **Self-deprecating asides**: > "this sounds super douchy I'm not trying to sound like a like that okay". - **Bro-casual address**: "bro" used by both speakers — > "bro it is going", > "oh bro bro I I I can't". ## Recurring Phrases & Habits - **"Hold on for dear life"** appears twice, describing business growth: > "we've been holding on for dear life like seat belts" and > "in the Summers we are all holding on for dear life". - **Repetition for emphasis** — stammering a word multiple times: > "uh uh uh the fourth quarter", > "no no I I I guess", > "I I I I I'm just kind of waiting and watching". - **Relational name-drops / shout-outs** are a stable pattern: "shout out bug Buck", references to Killingsworth, Mike and Debbie Rogers, John Speed, Phil Taylor, Scott mcney, Jim Mel. - **Named metaphor invention** for client stages: > "they're still in the laundry room I call it the laundry room phase". ## Teaching / Advisory Delivery - When asked for industry advice, he shifts into a **structured coaching mode** with a clear recommendation: > "my encouragement to everybody in this industry would be use this year don't see it as a loss see this as The New Normal" - Supports points with **family-history anecdotes**: > "like Dad would always say 2008 was his best year". - Uses **concrete geographic/market examples** (Charlotte vs. New York, > "10 offices One Market"). ## Interruptions & Environment - **Ambient conference disruption** is directly observable: > "is that okay yeah okay yeah you can keep talking" — suggesting an interruption mid-answer that he rolls with. ## Stability vs. Isolated Moments - **Stable patterns**: filler-heavy hesitation, relational references, humor-forward tone, coaching-style answers when prompted for advice. - **Isolated**: the homeschool branding joke, while recurring, is context-specific to this follow-up conversation; insufficient evidence it's a general habit. # Observation Record: Lizard Marketing CEO Mat Rogers | Live from PestWorld 2023 ## Participants - **Mat Rogers** — CEO, Lizard Marketing (identified by title and transcript context) - **Interviewer** — host of the conversation (unidentified in transcript; references "the Buzz" podcast) ## Lizard Marketing Business Update ### Growth Since Puerto Rico - Rogers states the company has been at Lizard about **two years as of May** ("it will be two years this may"). - After the Puerto Rico session (~May/April): "things blew up after we got back... we're up like a thousand percent or something like that." - The team used PestWorld for "real serious conversations" about scaling and planning for 2024. - He describes the year as a "rocket ship" rather than a roller coaster. ### New Service Offerings - **Inbound and branding support**: Rogers claims many pest control startups lack a clear vision of their identity and market differentiation. - **Executive/planning support**: He meets with partners lacking a CMO or VP of marketing to help plan the next year — setting benchmarks, KPIs, budgets, and quarterly expectations. - He qualifies the executive support framing: "this sounds super douchy I'm not trying to sound like that." ### Partner Segmentation (stated reasoning) - Partners from **Anticimex** ("po partners... that come from pomac") already have planning infrastructure in place. - Partners from **Bug Out** ("bug bucks" per transcript) are in what he calls the **"laundry room phase"** — referencing Mike and Debbie Rogers' early days heating a room with a dryer — and need "extra TLC." ## Rogers Amazing Homeschool - Three children; schooling is **50/50** between Mat and his wife Katie. - Division of labor: Mat handles morning setup ("lunch lady in the morning"), spot-checks midday between staff meetings, and wraps up the day; Katie monitors during the day. - **Curriculum**: post-pandemic online resources — "everything's online now." - **Reported metrics**: kids' "lowest GPA right now is 3.85"; done by 10:00 daily, an hour of leisure reading daily, chores, "no screens through the week." - **Socialization concern** (raised by interviewer): Rogers says it "becomes incumbent on us" to prioritize social interaction — sleepovers, youth groups, field trips — calling it "an extra little hassle but... better than trying to figure out what the hell the school's teaching your kid." - First homeschool field trip: Pearl Harbor, during a week on Oahu's North Shore with the Drapers. - He declines to turn the homeschool into a business: "I turn it down I got too many businesses going." ## Personal / Family - **Ethiopia NGO trip**: planned for early November with the same NGO as a prior trip; the nonprofit is hiring a new COO (interviews planned). Trip status **unresolved** due to security risks and a Department of State-type security advisory; "I'm just waiting and watching... the last thing I'm going to do... is put myself in any kind of situation at the adverse cost of my family." - Deflects LDS questions; notes many industry colleagues and new partners are LDS, and self-describes as a "cousin" in faith terms unlikely to be proselytized. - Classifies his father Mike Rogers' "redneck" status with a grading scale: from Canton, NC, but "just below the southern gentleman" — chivalrous, yes-ma'am/no-sir, "not double wide." - Says his brother Paul is "the favorite son" ("I tell that Dad to his face right now"). ## Industry Positions & Marketing Advice ### Re-baselining post-pandemic metrics (key claim) - Everyone's pandemic-era metrics were inflated; companies should **stop comparing to the prior year** and use the current year as "The New Normal" for 2024 planning. - Claims some companies made "aggressive plans based on inflated numbers." - Invokes his father's claim that **2008 (housing crisis) was his best year** as evidence the industry is resilient. ### Online marketing costs - Interviewer asks if online marketing costs will go down. Rogers: they will decline **"slowly"** because "players are still dumping money in and seeing a diminishing return" — specifically, "most of the PCOs that we talk to tell us LSA is not working for them anymore." As spending evens out, expect "better Optics and better predictability." ### Real estate as billboard - Praises his father's strategy of buying buildings and renting them back to the company — building wealth while signaling "open for business" at a central location. - Claims it benefits **Google Business Profile, website keywords, and visibility**; he "highly recommend[s]" it. - Contextualizes regionally: Killingsworth had 10 offices in one market; Scott McNeely did similar; the South differs from the North because "the south... they want to do business with people that they see" and is geographically spread out (e.g., Charlotte requires vehicles, 20–30 minutes to get anywhere). He concedes it "wouldn't be as advantageous" in the North. Notes Jim Mel had "$26 million in Revenue out of one office with like no sign" as a counterpoint. ### Seasonality - Expected Q4 to slow down, but PestWorld plus partners planning for 2024 has kept them busy; "I don't know if we'll have an offseason." ## Side Venture (Moonlighting) - Helping launch a healthcare company of doctors **bypassing health insurance**; it launched during PestWorld week. - Claim: US health costs are "somewhere like 60 to 70% inflated where they should be." - His role: built a marketing strategy targeting businesses (healthcare alternative for employees), doctors (same-day payment vs. waiting 30–60 days), and individuals. ## On John Spink (as transcribed "John speed") - Interviewer nominates him as having a "more amazing" homeschool (year-long around-the-world trip while running the business remotely). - Rogers: "I'm not at John speed success yet"; praises him as an "elder statesmen" and "super chill" — "it's frustrating to be so successful and so cool." - Rogers says he would do a similar trip with his kids: "100% wouldn't even hesitate." ## Contact - lizardmarketing.co ## Qualifications & Unresolved Points - Ethiopia trip: **undecided**, contingent on security conditions. - Interviewer's framing of marketing costs was corrected by Rogers (slow decline due to ongoing overspending, not immediate drop). - Transcript contains garbled names/figures (e.g., "bug bucks," "po/pomac," "John speed") preserved here with hedged attribution. # Speaker & Provenance Observation Record ## Video Metadata - **Title:** *Lizard Marketing CEO Mat Rogers | Live from PestWorld 2023* - **Video ID:** `01a168c8-a59c-7d12-8c4b-ebf033a4f69a` - **Setting:** Live on-stage interview, recorded at PestWorld 2023 (Hawaii location referenced; described as a follow-up to a prior Puerto Rico session). ## Identified Speakers & Roles ### Primary Guest — Mat Rogers - **Role:** CEO of **Lizard Marketing** (per title); guest interviewee. - Confirmed in transcript: approaching **two years** at Lizard as of that May. - **Personal facts stated by him:** runs "**Rogers Effing Amazing Home School**" with wife Katie (50/50 split, three children); son of **Mike and Debbie Rogers** (of "The Buzz" / Killingsworth fame); has a brother (Paul?) and a half-sister (age 33) on his mother's side; works with an **NGO in Ethiopia** (trip planned ~Nov 4, uncertain due to security risks); moonlighting as fractional CMO for a startup by doctors bypassing health insurance. ### Host / Interviewer (unnamed) - **Role:** Host/creator conducting the live interview; unnamed in transcript and title. - References his own prior interview with **John Speed** and **Phil Taylor** (Australian guest) the night before; refers to an off-stage person as "**the Mexican**". ### Mentioned Third Parties (not present) - **Mike and Debbie Rogers** — parents; former Killingsworth owners; discussed re: real estate as billboard marketing strategy. - **John Speed** — industry figure discussed; homeschooled his children on a year-long world trip while running his business remotely. - **Phil Taylor** — Australian, interviewed separately; impersonated Mike Rogers. - **Scott McNeely** — cited as having ~10 offices. - **Jim Mel** (spelling uncertain from transcript) — cited as $26M revenue from one office. - **Sam** — Mat's developer, mentioned as 8 hours ahead (decentralized team). - **Allan** — referenced in "I was telling Allan this last week." - **The Drapers** — accompanied Rogers family in Hawaii. - **"The Mexican"** — unnamed off-stage third party present at recording. ## Company / Promotional Segments - **Lizard Marketing** promotion embedded in interview content: - Website explicitly given at close: **lizardmarketing.co** (transcribed "lizard marketing . co") — clear call-to-action/contact channel. - Services described: **inbound marketing, branding support** for new pest control companies, and **executive support** (fractional CMO-style planning, budgets, KPIs for partners). - **Partner companies named:** Killingsworth (former employer of Mat), **Aptive** (transcript: "anti-six" / "pomac" — garbled), **Bug Out** (transcript "bug bucks"), Potomac (as "pomac"). - **Rogers Effing Amazing Home School** — recurring branded segment topic; Mat states he declines requests to turn it into a business. ## Claims with External Provenance (unverified in source) - U.S. health costs "60–70% inflated." - Doctors typically waiting 30–60 days for payment. - U.S. State Department security notice ("posted yesterday") affecting Ethiopia travel. - Mike Rogers' 2008 "best year" claim — attributed to Mike Rogers via Mat. - Lizard "up like a thousand percent" since Puerto Rico session — Mat's own claim. ## Availability & Limitations - **No curated metadata supplied** — speaker identity beyond Mat Rogers is inferred from transcript only. - **Host name unknown**; second speaker's identity not established. - **No comment availability information** provided. - Several proper nouns are phonetically garbled in the transcript (e.g., "anti-six," "pomac," "bug bucks," "Jim Mel") and cannot be verified. - **No timestamps** present in transcript. ## Uncertainty Flags - Brother's name ("Paul") uncertain from audio. - Company names for partners are best-guess reconstructions from garbled audio. check oh shoot it's loud too this is the followup from the Puerto Rico session don't ask me any LDS questions I will not I don't have the answers to that all right Matt it's good to see you down here in Hawaii always always a pleasure to see you so you're hanging out I mean I wasn't going to ask any LDS questions but since you raised it you can't I don't know them I mean you're hanging out with it you work with a lot of LDS guys now yes a lot a lot is it like majority LDS even the new partners that we have it's funny because at at Killingsworth I was telling Allan this last week uh uh at Killingsworth the rise of the door Todo had not come to the industry just yet and dad used to say all the time those Mormon companies out there in the west damn Mormons company Mormons stealing all the business blah blah blah have you been now I feel like everybody I know is LDS that's the truth have you been enticed to join the club like you think about it is it like no no I I guess you're not shopping I think in terms of like in terms of a faith conversation we're kind of like cousins and so they they may not need they may not see a need to to prze me I mean do they want to I mean they do a lot of missions so do they want to bring you into the club or I don't think so I think I think we're better without some my tattoos and my tequila and they're like not that guy okay so you've been at lizard now for what about a year and a half is that right it will be two years this may so about a year and a half wow okay and everyone knows Mike and Debbie Rogers anyone that listens to the buzz does for sure would you classify Mike Rogers as a true redneck I love you dad I mean he is from Canton North Carolina and if you've ever been to Canton North Carolina you would be like yeah I mean yeah yeah the answer to that question is probably yeah but I feel like he actually went to Redneck Mecca though he moved from North Carolina and then went to the redneck Riviera yeah yes yes so like it wasn't enough Kon wasn't it wasn't good enough for him no the thing about it is though there are levels right there's like Lumberton and then there's like Southern gentleman and dad is I feel like just below the southern gentleman he is he's a sweetheart of a Gody he is he's still yes ma'am uh yes sir no ma'am no sir hold the door for people very very chalous he's not he's not he's not double wide no do you know what I mean no so there's there's levels inside of there for sure you know I never thought about it that way so I appreciate you bringing that up now it's important to classify your rednecks you and your brother got a redneck grading scale mhm your brother though has takes more after your father than you do I would say right so messed up Paul definitely in temperament uh uh uh and nurture my brother takes a lot after my father he looks a lot like not my father no he doesn't but I feel like he was like kind of the favored son girl he is the favorite son if he's watching he's the favorite I was not the favorite I I I tell that Dad to his face right now yeah I I could see that cuz you know I see your father going to racing with them and all sorts of stuff while you can you flip people off from pic can I just did that I just flipped somebody off that's okay that's kosher on our you can do whatever you want especially when it's Brothers yeah yeah yeah sisters yeah can do that too but but you don't have any sister so okay I do have I have a half sister really yeah on my mom's I did know that the Mexican would say is she hot I'm not going to say that okay I don't want him to get any ideas if she wasn't you would have said it doesn't even matter to the Mexican I'm not even sure it matters some levels of sobriety what's your age difference between the two of you uh my sister just turned 33 I think oh yeah Mexican no you stay over there Mexican's 33 oh there you go still um that's a hard not I don't want to be related to that guy at all the Rogers amazing no \[ \_\_ \] amazing homeo y that started that kicked off when bro it is going my my kids's lowest GPA right now is 3.85 right that's that's my my most underperforming student oh I won't say which one cuz I don't have favorites uh but that's my most underperforming student they're done every day by like 10:00 they are uh uh reading uh for leisure for an hour a day every day they're doing their chores there's no screens through the week it's Bliss we just had them here we brought them here uh with the Drapers uh for a week before pest World okay and the first Roger \[ \_\_ \] amazing homeschool uh uh field trip was to Pearl Harbor so they did like research so that's a school s the principal has spoken we're going to PE Harbor oh that's great yeah how long were they out here they were here for a week we were up on the NorthShore for a week and it was like quintessential perfect Hawaii it was perfect now will they get graded on their performance I I was I had a little bit too much room to to grade things accurately I feel like so your wife will be grading you on your performance on the performance of the principal of the Rogers effing amazing home school yeah how many children are in that school there's three and I have people like can my kid come to Rogers having amazing homes school I'm like no you should turn it into a business no I turn it down I got too many businesses going at this particular moment and I'm tired I mean how much this is on the back of Katie versus you uh it's 50/50 oh really it's 50/50 really she's much more in the so I'm the setup at the beginning of the day feed everybody I'm lunch lady in the morning right so I get the coffee pot going feed all of the kids uh go through the agendas for the day I I do sometimes if I'm feeling like it I go through the agenda for the day uh and make sure everybody's got their heads on straight and then I go do my meetings with my staff and then I come spot check through the day and Katie's kind of during the day just making sure they're doing whatever and then I wrap up the end of the day make sure they did all their stuff this both do you have to ask I are you teaching lessons like a teacher would you sit down and say Hey you a history no pandemic has kind of set us up for Success everything's online now go so yeah yeah so we just kind of plug them in and get the party started now clearly the quality of education and experience is quite high at the Rogers \[ \_\_ \] amazing home school M I think always the concern with homeschooling is the the lack of social social interaction I'm wondering how you dealing with that how do you make sure your kids are not they don't social Le like 20-year-old like like uh wearing their socks or or tight rolling their jeans or can ask a girl functionally out on a DAT why basically all of your style and substance transferred to them we've got to do we it's it becomes incumbent on us I feel like to then make sure that social interaction is a priority for all of them so we got to do the sleepovers we got to do the youth groups we got to do the field trips we got to do the you know it's our job now to make sure that they're social so it's just kind of a extra extra little hassle but it's better than trying to figure out what the hell the school's teaching your kid I'll take it any day you know I found a I may and I I really didn't want to say this to you in person but I may have found a home school that's more \[ \_\_ \] amazing than Roger's amazing \[ \_\_ \] homeo school names yesterday names I need Nam John speed John speed does he homeschool his kids kids and he took them on around the world homeschooling trip for a year running his business remotely lizard's not that successful yet we had an amazing year since bomic but we're not that successful yet I'm not at John speed success yet one of these days principal Rogers will snatch said children and take them on an Excursion would you do that though would you do oh 100% wouldn't even hesitate yeah yeah for sure I mean I I I hated to say this to you when I there with John yesterday I was listening to him I'm like you know down really is amazing but this is more amazing he's so cooling down to earth in fact unassuming he started talking to me and I hadn't even put together that that's who he was and then he told me I was like I didn't know he homeschooled though he the radar like more of a g yeah he is he's one of the Elder statemen in the industry he's frustrating super chill guy he's actually yeah he's great it's frustrating to be so successful and so cool that's the thing man he's been able to pull it off you know he's not like this hyper like yeah there's so much of that in this industry there is I hope so tell me you know we talked a little about homeschooling I want to go back to lizard but I don't want to focus too much on it so what have you guys done in the give me the rundown since you were down in PR when were you in PR you were there in uh we were May yeah it was this year really May or April is things blew up things blew up after we got back we've been holding on for dear life like seat belts spot checking all my because we're decentralized so I got me my my developer he's eight hours ahead of me hey Sam you doing okay since we blew up right we're up like a th% or something like that did anyone watch your Puerto Rico video they did some we yes they did we get we get calls still about the Puerto Ric and I still get questions about Roger \[ \_\_ \] amazing home school I bet all the time now we've answered I'm glad we've done this followup yes uh so things have blown up we've we've retooled espec since the team has been here and sat down and had like real serious conversations okay if we are going to continue to scale at this pace uh what do we need what does it look like how do we plan and prep for 2024 so it's been that was an incredible experience for us uh uh and it has been a roller coaster ever since or rocket ship I feel like rocket ship is a better a better adjective or a better metaphor for what this year has been like for sure have have you added on any additional Services since you were down PR or no you oh you we're focusing on inbr and brand uh inbound and branding so so many so many pest control companies get started and they don't have a clear vision of who they are or how they want to present themselves to their Market what differentiates them from the market so we're offering branding support for uh uh companies that are just getting started that don't don't know how to express that part of themselves they don't have I mean you know ladies gentl and then uh um we're also offering um executive support for is that okay yeah okay yeah you can keep talking we're also offering like uh executive support uh for meetings this sounds super douchy I'm not trying to sound like a like that okay I I'll offer my I'll meet with um if people don't have a CMO or VP of marketing whatever internally they don't have a plan I'll meet with our partners and help them prep out there next year we're doing that a lot right now actually is people are getting ready for 2024 what and what does that mean though so you you what do you mean when you say you'll help them prep out for this so I mean it's at Killingsworth and definitely anti-six uh uh October was a huge month to be like okay this is where we should close the Year this is how to prepare for uh uh the next year right and so a lot of companies are thinking like that they're still thinking month to month week to week even sometimes and so to help them zoom out to make a strategy to develop the benchmarks and the kpis to be like okay we've made it through the first quarter what should we expect to see what should we expect to see in the second third and how do we close that next year how do we make a budget right uh uh I'm I'm helping I'm leveraging some of my experience to do that for some of our partners and that's been really valuable for some of our partners some of our partners especially our new partners especially po partners that come from pomac they already have a lot of these things in place and that's fantastic but the partners that come from bug bucks shout out bug Buck uh they are just they're still in the laundry room I call it the laundry room phase for Mike and Debbie Rogers right where Debbie's holding the the dryer open to heat the room in the winters right they're still there and that's awesome and so they need they need little extra TLC and so we've been giving them that is that interfering it's not going to bother the end prodct doesn't bother me so yeah we doing what we can that's great what uh we're here now almost in November what what are your plans here at the end of the year business non- business are you going anywhere you off for Christmas I can't wait I can't wait to get home I'm supposed to head back to Ethiopia work with an NGO same NGO same thing oh that's weird yeah uh I went the week after yes that's right I'm heading there uh the beginning of November again for the nonprofit that I work with they're getting a new coo so we're interviewing the COO and that's going to be awesome but things are complicated right now security risks so I'm trying to figure that out when were you supposed to go looking for chill November 4 oh yeah but the department of security like yesterday posted hey if you're American and you're International fls yeah so it's complicated so trying to figure that out I'm I'm honestly especially after last week and this week my family went home on Monday I'm just ready to get home and see my family and chill yeah yeah we're going to try to keep it chill for the end of the year so do you think you're going to cancel the Ethiopia trip I don't know I I I I I'm just kind of waiting and watching right things are seem really ous everywhere right now and kind of everybody's trying to figure out where they fall right or if they need to um um uh and so I'm just trying to be respectful and be mindful cuz the last thing I'm going to do especially right now is put myself in any kind of situation uh at the adverse cost of my family so just being mindful yeah what's the busiest time for you business wise bro I thought that the third uh the fourth quarter was going to like turn it down but with this with uh pest world but also with partners that are gearing up that had a successful uh 2022 and are cranking it up to 11 for 2023 it's actually been busy now so I feel like in the Summers we are all holding on for dear life and just making sure we're getting these leads to our partners and then now in the planning phases people are working on their websites uh people are working on their game plans and we're still just as busy it's I don't I don't know if we'll have an offseason I don't know I don't I'm hopeful that we can get a break in here somewhere but last week was quite the break I was truly able to disconnect you to the NorthShore yeah I was in kilowa that's where I don't know where that is Northshore so all you got to do is get out of here go left or right until you get up to this like like historic town at the top of the island and everywhere you turn is like perfect to why like postcard Beach that nobody's on it was beautiful sea turtles Surfers food trucks it was great did you surf no man I I have no balance I don't either I don't I wouldn't look cool uh I I would look like like uh um uh like a a dad trying to Surf and be cool but I wouldn't be so outside of travel yep lizard y your homeschool yeah what else are you up to oh bro bro I I I can't I don't we just launched I guess I can say this I've been I told you briefly I have been Moonlighting to help a um a company get started with the chief marketing officer that's doing its best it's a bunch of doctors that have all gotten together to kind of uh bypass uh health insurance it's fascinating our health costs uh in the United States are somewhere like 60 to 70% inflated where they should be yeah and so uh they just launched they launched while I was here and so I have actually a very busy week when I get back uh but that's that's the other hustle and what are you doing for them I am uh they've got a strong marketing strategy that I've built out for them uh that's going to scale with their subscribers uh um but uh um basically I'm trying to uh use uh different marketing channels to talk to businesses that might use them as a healthcare alternative uh uh for their employees to doctors that would use them for their practices because the doctors get paid the same day which is they're mostly having a file and wait like 60 30 to 60 days or to individuals like any of my staff members who might use something like this so I've got a marketing strategy to kind of hit all these places and I'm going to get these things in place and help them out speaking of marketing strategy we had Phil Taylor the Australian guy did you meet him no he's from Australia we interviewed oh yeah yeah yeah last night yes he said that he listens to the buzz and he listened to your father and Debbie talk he he told me to talk talk like him last night he's like I don't believe he's your dad can you talk like him I can't speak Australian I try but can you speak Mike Rogers like Mike Rogers uh hell yes I can speak like Mike Rogers and then he's like uhhuh okay I heard him try to do it too yeah it was bad it was really bad you couldn't even get him to do the American accd yeah like a Brit speaking like a southerner is not a recipe for success but he started he's into this whole like using real estate as a billboard your father oh yeah I talked to so many companies here about that uh this week that're trying to figure out how to expand their reach and what to do the move that this was dad's move and it was brilliant it was even after he sold it to and simix he would he and Debbie would buy the building and then rent it back through the company from they were just paying themselves growing their portfolios of uh wealth and then they had this building at a central location uh that they let it up and let everybody know that they were open for business and it matters to Google it matters to uh uh your Google my business page it matters to the keywords on your uh uh website it matters so I I highly recommend I think he's doing good on him for uh yeah uh uh making that move it's a big deal how how invested is he in that has he like made a lot of like a lot of real estate or is he just getting started no I I think he just I mean the company's relatively small I think he I I don't on the interview yesterday he mentioned I think maybe two facilities now but you know it's all about testing it right yeah heck yeah that had 10 10 and one market everybody thinks killings Earth was everywhere there was 10 offices One Market yes and it's you know Scott mcney did the same thing he had like 10 offices I I see that a lot in the South it doesn't happen you know everyone up in New York has one service center like I was talking about Jim Mel had $26 million in Revenue out of one office with like no sign yeah yeah but the south is different they want to do business with people that they see and then go over there and we're spread out too though you know what I'm saying sometimes when you go to the north you've got condensed areas of concentrated population right true you come down to the South I think the funniest thing about uh Charlotte in particular is uh everybody it's a it's a it's a vehicle everybody's got a vehicle it's not a place for public transportation you know what I mean and it takes 20 30 minutes to get anywhere that's true so it just kind of depends I guess on where you're at but you're probably right in the north I don't think that would be as advantageous what's one thing you discovered this year that can help folks out when they're thinking about marketing their businesses everybody all of your pest control companies that are listening we all just came through the pandemic and it spiked everybody's metrics right I think if our industry everybody no matter what they're doing from a marketing perspective from a budgeting perspective from a chemical cost gas cost whatever they can use this year as a new level set of how to expect the last year and stop comparing this year to the year behind us because the metrics for the year behind us are uh inflated big inflation right now I think things are coming back to normal and people can start to make more realistic plans I think some of the some of the things that happened post pandemic where people made aggressive plans based on inflated numbers right and so my encouragement to everybody in this industry would be use this year don't see it as a loss see this as The New Normal right and use it to make much more informed and concise decisions about what your 2024 is going to look like um uh because it's these are truer numbers than what we experience enjoy it right like Dad would always say 2008 was his best year uh uh which was the housing crisis and you know what I mean uh we have a a very resilient uh uh industry which is awesome but you've got these peaks of performance that often have to do with things that are going on in the market and now that those things are behind us uh uh use these new numbers to kind of get back to normal you know so do you think the cost of online marketing is going to go down am I understanding you or no I think what's it's going to go down slowly because I think players are still dumping money into I can see it like most of the PCOS that we talk to tell them tell us LSA is not working for them anymore um uh and so I think people are still dumping money in and seeing a diminishing return and so what I think is going to happen is slowly the investments in those places are going to start to happen as things start to kind of even out I see right and so I think we'll have well it'll it'll give everybody better Optics and better predictability for next year it definitely gives us as a digital marketing company a better understanding of like this is how you can manage your expectations for next year that's much more realistic than you've had this past year right Matt if somebody out there wants to track you down how should they find you yeah lizard marketing . co uh that's it awesome I know you didn't even know you were on the docket today we just popped on stage always great talking to you brother always always thank you so much cheers yeah Jo